Lies, damn lies and Youth Defence

Many of you will be well aware of the anti choice group Youth Defence (I’m not going to link to the page as I don’t want to help increase their traffic or your blood pressure!). You will also no doubt be aware of the many questionable declarations they make about abortion in Ireland.

Once such claim is this: “During Election 2011 Fine Gael promised they would not allow abortion to be legalised in Ireland.” 

Taken from YD Website on 19th November 2012

Where is the evidence of this promise?

Ah, I know… it will be in the Fine Gael 2011 Election Manifesto! Oh hold on a second – I can’t find any such promise. In fact the only reference to abortion in the 80 page document is this on page 25:

Taken from Section 4 of the FG Election Manifesto 2011: Children, Older People and the Family.

To me that almost seems like a statement of progress. I’d love to know how Youth Defence think setting up an expert group equates to a pro life promise? It’s obviously a feat of semantic gymnastics I am not yet familiar with. But hold on a sec, maybe I’m mistaken. Maybe this ‘promise’ is in the Programme for Government.

Well there’s only one way to find out! Here’s the Programme for Government 2011… and here are the references to abortion:

There are no references to abortion in the Programme for Government

However there is a reference to the X Case:

Taken from the Fairness Section (PG 37) of the 2011 Programme for Government

Again no ‘pro life promise’ instead two references to expert groups being set up to address issues. This Expert Group has now given their report to Cabinet. It’s up to all of us to remind Enda of HIS ACTUAL PARTY POSITION not the one Youth Defence made up for him. Write to all the Fine Gael TDs in your constituency now using this fantastic NWCI Tool and remind them of what their own manifesto says!

And don’t forget the Labour TDs who not only signed up to the Programme for Government but also have an established position to legislate for the X case.

Don’t you just hate it when someone *cough Youth Defence cough* is telling porkies!

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15 Responses to Lies, damn lies and Youth Defence

  1. Gni Phrom says:

    good article and more and more things show how YD are shockingly uneducated on the truth of things.

  2. Lute al-Raad says:

    Well done, thank you! I do believe it says something when a group of people have to start making things up to “make a point”, uh?

  3. Pingback: Is FG capitulation now complete? (Croke pk, prop tax, gay marriage & now abortion) - Page 4

  4. Wendy Lyon says:

    Not to mention, legislating for X is not “legalising abortion”. It’s already legal under the X circumstances.

  5. I’ve raised on your facebook page that there WAS a commitment given. You have persisted with perpetuating this and you have not removed this post, even though it has been pointed out to you that there was indeed a commitment given.
    Please remedy this – it’s staggeringly hypocritical to have a post criticising supposed ‘lies’ of others, then leave up the post when it has been pointed out to you that the post is not true.

    http://prolifecampaign.ie/plc/?page_id=442

    • Evelyn if you have a link to where this promise appears on any Fine Gael branded site I will amend the post.

      • The second link is a letter from their director of elections giving the guarantee.

      • Hi Evelyn,

        All the letter indicates is that Fine Gael is opposed to the legalisation of abortion. Abortion in line with the X case is legal and a constitutional right as determined by the Supreme Court. Therefore we believe that this ‘pro life promise’ does not include the X case scenario.

      • The commitment given was not to introduce legislation.

        As you know well, giving effect to X would involve legislation.

        The commitment didn’t say “Fine Gael is opposed to legislating some abortion, we think X is fine.” The commitment said that Fine Gael was opposed to abortion legislation. There was no qualifying statement or conditions to this.

        It couldn’t me more clear.

    • mollydot says:

      Even if “legalisation of abortion” means what you say it means, what words imply a promise, guarantee or commitment?

  6. Wendy Lyon says:

    No, it says that “Fine Gael is opposed to the legalisation of abortion”. That is not the same thing as “Fine Gael is opposed to abortion legislation”. The difference between the two sentences is perhaps too subtle for some people to work out, and no doubt Fine Gael banked on that when they wrote that letter, but they are nonetheless completely different statements.

    As I’ve already pointed out in these comments, legislating for X is not legalising abortion. Abortion has already been legalised in the X circumstances. The voters did it when they passed the 1983 referendum. The Supreme Court recognised and declared this in the X case. That ship has sailed.

    In fact, what FG mean by this statement couldn’t be less clear. They have no power, on their own, to either legalise abortion where it isn’t already legal or illegalise it where it is. Any move in either direction would require a further referendum. Are they saying they are opposed to a referendum to make it legal in other circumstances? Are they saying they now (retrospectively) oppose the referendum they supported in 1983 which made it legal in the X circumstances?

    Or are they simply throwing out a phrase which has no real meaning other than being a statement of their general view about abortion, and allowing readers to draw their own conclusions?

    My money’s on the latter.

    • Then why isn’t the post about exploring that?

      Why doesn’t the post deal with the commitment in any fashion? Even now, the post entirely omits the commitment.

      If you think the commitment is flawed or ambiguous or whatever, then talk about that. But discussing the perceived lack of a commitment and wilfully omitting the commitment when it has been brought to the attention of CF is lying through omission, which is pretty poor, especially in the same post that purports to expose ‘lies’ of others.

      • Wendy Lyon says:

        There was no commitment! That’s the entire point. How could there be a commitment when it isn’t even clear from the statement what exactly Fine Gael mean by “the legalisation of abortion”?

      • We’re with Wendy on this one Evelyn. Think we’ll have to agree to disagree. The comments are here for everyone to read and I posted an update to our other social media sites so people can see your viewpoint. We love nothing more than honesty about the anti choice campaign.

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